امروز : یکشنبه, ۱۴ خرداد , ۱۴۰۲
فيلم: شهرسازی بدون خودرو
Title:شهرسازی بدون خودرو گفتگو با طراحان/معماران شهری درگیر با Culdesac Tempe و Culdesac Atlanta، دو پیشرفت بسیار تماشایی که اتومبیلها را در مناطق مسکونی حذف میکنند، که امکان راهحلهای طراحی شهری نوآورانه را فراهم میکند. این برنامه شامل Dan Parolek از Opticos Design و Eric Kronberg از Kronberg Architects + Urbanists بود. قسمتي از متن […]
Title:شهرسازی بدون خودرو
گفتگو با طراحان/معماران شهری درگیر با Culdesac Tempe و Culdesac Atlanta، دو پیشرفت بسیار تماشایی که اتومبیلها را در مناطق مسکونی حذف میکنند، که امکان راهحلهای طراحی شهری نوآورانه را فراهم میکند. این برنامه شامل Dan Parolek از Opticos Design و Eric Kronberg از Kronberg Architects + Urbanists بود.
قسمتي از متن فيلم: Alright! Great! I think we can go ahead and get started. Thank you. Everyone so much for joining us today. Welcome to on the park bench a public square conversation.
Brought to you by Congress for the new urbanism on the Park Bench, prison conversations with thought leaders in new urbanism and Allied industries providing an opportunity audience to engage in real time.
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You can learn more about firstname.lastname@example.org. And now for today’s webinar. You’d like to welcome Dan Perlock. Dan is an urban designer and architect, author, and the founding principle of opticos design. A b corporation focused on equitable urban place making innovative housing, design and policy and zoning reform for walkable urbanism.
Dan and his work have been featured in many high profile publications, including the New York Times, San Francisco Chronicle.
Next, city, fast company and curved. Dan has championed the missing middle housing movement, launched missing middle housing.com, and wrote the book, missing middle housing, thinking big and building small to respond to today’s housing, crisis which is now available from Island press and we’d also like to
Welcome Eric Chromeberg. Eric Chronberg is a zoning whisperer. He specializes in examining and demystifying, zoning ordinances to help find ways to make great projects possible and help others navigate through the zoning swamp. He uses his skills for the force of good as a principal at chromebook.
Cronberg, urbanists and architects being the firm’s predevelopment efforts by combining skills in planning, development, architecture and zoning.
Eric leverages this potent cocktail to chart the course of best possibilities for each sites, redevelopment his work with Kua, the Incremental Development Alliance, the Congress for the new Urbanism, the Georgia Conservancy and a Network Town Builders
Association has solidified his stance as an advocate for walkable and bikable communities and I’m Lauren, Mayor, the communications manager at Cnu. I am now going to hand the webinar over to Eric and Dan for presentations about cul-de-sac Tempe and cul de sac Atlanta will be followed by discussion with the Panelists.
We will then open up to questions from the audience, so please use the key and a function of zoom to ask your questions. As they occurred to you. Alright! Take it away, damn! Great. Thank you, Lauren, and hello to everybody. Good morning.
Good afternoon. It’s always a pleasure to be here on the park bench to have a active and engaged conversation, and this is a topic that obviously it’s super fun.
And one of my favorites to talk about delivering car, free urbanism in particular, focusing on our the cul-de-sac tempe project that we worked on with the cul de sac team, and you know, as I’m sure many of the people online are designing or planners, landscape architects.
It’s a real joy when you get a call from a client. That sort of asked you to take on a project like this? I think all of us over the course of I know over the course of my 25 plus year career.
Have always been thinking about sort of car, light, walkable urbanism, but like, be able to actually have the opportunity to really design a project that’s not hindered by the integration of the car is just a really amazing opportunity and just you know.
Kudos to Ryan Johnson and Jeff, barons, the founders of of call to sack to have this big have this vision to not just create a car free neighborhood like we did in this and Eric’s doing in Atlanta. But they have this much bigger vision of actually delivering a car free city.
Ultimately, which is really exciting to think about and I’m actually gonna start with a video. And I think this will. This should work. But because this project actually is becoming a reality, this is a video from about a month ago.
So I thought this would be good to just show this, so that people get a good sense of the overview of where the project’s currently at.
And it starts with this view over the Smith Martin Light Rail Station at the mixed view center of the project, and I think I turned off the music because it’s the typical sort of typical music from a Youtube video.
But I’m just gonna talk about a little bit as it goes through the video, and then I’ll show some additional slides. But the 3 mixed use buildings from the original plan are mostly completed.
The one of them will be occupied sometime in the next month, as the first residents start to move into the project, you can see the project that that slide show.
The project is about 2 miles from down town. Tempe, which is also where AI’s main campuses, and you can see here the restaurant in this image is actually Cochina Chiwas is actually now it’s actually open actually had a wonderful dinner.
There last week at a Uli conference in Phoenix, and met the met the chef. This building will have a 8,000 square foot market in the ground floor. It’s going to occupy that space sometime in the next couple of months. And you’ll notice that I’ll talk a little bit about this.
But the architecture is purposefully restrained. And I’ll talk a little bit more about that in my slides. But this is the main plaus of space, with a beautiful shade pavilion done by a local artist.
These are the live work units. And then this, this is just image going into the the inner block courtyard spaces which are really starting to fill fantastic in the trees. We’re starting to be put in last week. Or 2 weeks ago, when I was out there.
So it was really starting to feel like the, you know, the images and the intent design, intent that we are design team had, and local artists are really key. Part of sort of the programming and the the overall, reinforcing the sort of creative environment and sense of community in this project.
So you can see like it’s it’s I’ll give you some of the numbers.
But the first couple of phases are almost completed, and, as I mentioned earlier, the first tenants are gonna move, and I think just in terms of I have this broken down in a series about 4 sections, and the first one is just the idea.
And I won’t take credit for the idea. This is Culvsac, Jeff and Ryan’s big idea, but these are couple of slides from them. But I just think, you know, building creating a built environment designed from the ground up for shared mobility.
I think car free is what we often sort of frame. This conversation at has, but it’s sort of mobility. Rich is just another great way to be thinking about this and communicating it. And one of the really amazing things that the cul-de-sac team has done to really deliver this mobility.
Rich living experience for the residences. They’ve established partnerships with these local mobility companies and agencies to deliver up to.
I think it’s up to about delivers about up to $3,000 in annual value, or discounts for their residents, and discounted lift memberships discounted transit passes, discounted car share and mic and scooter sh so it’s
Really amazing that they’re thinking this way about not just providing car free, but actually delivering those mobility choices to the residents. I think just a couple of images on the inspiration. I think it’s pretty self explanatory in terms of what the place, starting to feel like and what the architecture is feeling like.
But obviously we had inspiration from an architecture and typology standpoint. That range from the real, beautiful vernacular buildings, and, like the barrier, Vie ho!
And Tucson to, you know Greek villages, Southern French villages, Egyptian villages, but also there’s some really beautiful deput, modern, a history of really beautiful desert, modern architecture and typology in this region that we also wanted to study and learn from and
Reflect and I just wanted to show this because we I discovered this architect, Egyptian architect, Hassan Fauci. Our team did and just really build sort of desert, responsive buildings that we studied as we explored this project.
And then from an urban urbanism standpoint, I think you know just the really narrow, informal, organic pedestrian ways that exist in all you know, historic communities around the world are really thoughtful public spaces that respond to the desert climate and then just the team also gravitated towards us.
Really, looking at this trend of really beautiful painted signage and public art to really reinforce the strong sense of place in a brand for the project in terms of the desert response of urbanism is obviously in a place like phoenix with such an extreme
Climate. It makes complete sense, especially when you’re removing the cars from the equation that the urbanism respond to that extreme desert climate, and this the project is about the sites about 16 acres, just a little over 600 units so 40
Dwelling units per acre, it would have been really easy for called the sax say, Hey, we wanna we wanna double that and go it up to 5 to 7 stories. But their vision. For this particular project, you know the started 4 years ago, as well.
Was a 2 to 3 story, walk up neighborhood, and we were easily able to achieve that 40 dwelling in its breaker and a 2 combination of 2 to 3 stories.
But there’s 0 residential parking spaces, and but there are parking spaces for the commercial and the food and beverage attendants in in the project, and you can see there is a.
That organize one of the organizing elements of this plan is this primary pset that goes to the East and the West, and that was partly driven by location of existing utilities from previous structures on the site.
But it was also driven in terms of the width of it by fire, access, and emergency, access to the to the project area. So in I’ll show you a diagram of the emergency access plan. But I think we delivered about a 60 page document to the fire chief to walk him through.
How he! Each one of these buildings, would be accessed in case of a fire. But you can see the the really Organic walk typologies. And I’m gonna talk a little bit more about that it’s just a the narrow P. Deliver what we call a series of theatrical events.
As you’re walking or biking, or scooting your way through the project from one end to the other. And this is the primary East, West, Paseo. We called it the spine in the design rounds.
It sort of terminates at the station, and that Cochina, Chiwas restaurant, and this is a view of the main plaza space. Obviously just being really thoughtful in terms of the size of it.
Wants to be big enough to sort of be an iconic space for the community, and a place where people can gather, but also not so big that when it’s a 100 degrees out that there’s not shaded places to sit and to congregate and meet up with friends and neighbors
Azure. And this is just that and similar image to what you saw sooner of that main point of space starting to take shape with this beautiful shade element from a from a local artist, and these are just some images of the typical this is a pretty typical primary public that’s
About between 8 and 10 feet from building face to building phase activated by frequent entries into the units, and every single unit has direct access to to say, Oh, but also to the core inner block courtyard spaces.
And this is just a this is the passage that goes from the main clause of space into the into the community and leads to network of those pose fire access, diagram.
You can see a series of. We wanted to keep the as narrow as possible, and so we’re really thoughtful about sort of creating as narrow as possible. And so we’re really thoughtful about sort sort of truncated access ways routes for the Emergent Fire and Emergency access vehicles.
So that we could, you know, not just really not just blow out and create really wide the CEO.
So we’re done, really spent a lot of time thinking about this access and making sure, working with the fire chief and his team to to make sure that they were comfortable with the routes that we were providing for that access.
And this is just a view from the transit station down the main spine. The first 2, just a quick summary of the first 2 phases that have been built. It’s about a 175 units in those first 2 phases, and mostly completed at this point.
Housing and block types once again desert responsibility in their approach. But we created a system of unique but repeatable building types.
They’re all walkup. None of them have internal cost corridors, and they’re all one room deep to maximize a natural wide, and passive cooling, and the buildings were intended to be organized around inter block courtyard spaces. This seems to be most people’s favorite image of the project to date.
Hopefully, it will be replaced by a photograph with an in the next year, with some landscaping and people in it.
And then those types are organized to create these blocks that have a network in a hierarchy of courtyard spaces, and every block has a primary courtyard that’s bigger than the rest of them, and then a series of secondary and tertiary courtyards that are connected
By narrow passageways, and these are just some of the images of so a couple of those blocks in progress, and one of those primary courtyards right here that’s starting to get the landscaping.
You can see the the seating area to the right, and then some of the narrow passages that connect between those a passageways and terms of the architecture. I mentioned this earlier, but I just wanted to mention we really challenged ourselves to deliver, really thoughtfully restrained architecture.
You know, it’s fairly similar to what the precedents that you saw on that imagery, whether it’s in the barrio, in Tucson or a Greek or Egyptian village, and it’s really important that it just lets the buildings play
Their role as fabric buildings and to divine it, define and activate the public spaces and and in terms of the last section just wanted to talk a little bit about the community. This is a piece that people don’t really know that much about.
Typically as there were a bunch, a number of really great tenants, including the street corner urban Market Cochina and the Fire Creek Coffee Company that have leases, a great curating on called the cul-de-sac teams part to get these tenants in and
To provide these amenities, and just a part of that, you know, delivering that walkability. In that sense of place, but the cul de sac team has also been really amazing. At incubating, implanting the seeds of community through pop up events on site and through their social media, as well.
And this was an early popup event on the site. And more recently they’ve been doing what they called with little chola events every Thursday night that have local artists that sell their their crafts on the main plaza space.
So it’s you know, it’s it’s a really great way to start creating that sense of place and creating it as a destination in supporting the local artist community.
And you know, really amazing public art taking shape in the project as well, which is, I think, just really gives us that added layer of placement and really roots it in its region. And as someone who’s a real sort of fan of street art.
I’m super thrilled to see like over the course of years of studying street art in London, and Barcelona in Rome and Paris. So just like how street art can really help define the creative nature of of a community, and in terms of just some last slides, we can talk about these later.
But people get a little bit. This the project, on the left is actually the project that we entitled on the site. It wasn’t actually feasible. So it’s sat entitled for a number of years before the call to set team.
Acquired the property, but you can see these are actually the same scale, and the previous project had about 7, just a little under 700 units, and about 1,400 parking spaces, and our 2 and 3 story version has 640 units and 200 spaces for just 3
To 1010. So you can see how the parking integration of the parking really inflates the scale. The necessary scale of the buildings to get to a very similar program. And you know, this is just the vision that’s really coming to reality.
Now that it’s really amazing to see this I was last there a couple of weeks ago, and took a bunch of these slides and I do just want to say that you know I’m the one sort of participating this.
But I have a very talented team at optic hosts, and I just want to give them sort of a pat on the back, for you know, collaborating with the cul de sac team to deliver this this amazing project and the cul-de-sac Tempe project is one of
The case, studies in my missing middle housing book, so I don’t. If you scan the barcode the QR code here, it’ll take you directly to that book.
But I’m also fairly active on Linkedin. So if you wanna sort of I occasionally we’ll post on called the Sack, or some of our other missing middle projects for public or private, but with that all handed off to Eric to talk about his cul-de-sac work in Atlanta. Eric, you’re on mute.
That’s even better, and how you can hear. Thank you, Dan. Hello, everybody! Thank you, Dan, for that great walkthrough Temp and Kolk Atlanta is definitely at a much earlier stage of development. To say the least, we’ve helped with some of the entitlements and site chasing its initial design.
Urban oasis is a great local partner, helping, called the sack in pursuit of some things. Here as well. Let me see if I can make my share. My mouse is there we go! And so for a little bit of context of what’s going on in Atlanta, the gray is our city limits.
The, cyan. Tish color is the proposed location of the Atlanta Beltline. That is our great 22 Mile mobility focused border. That is really focusing development. This northeast quadrant is mostly built out. The southwest quadrant is partially built out.
We’ve got 2 projects. We’re all been called to sack with in the Southwest Quadrant, and from a economic and racial standpoint northeast, rich, white. Southeast, southwest, and northwest, basically poor and African, American. The other thing that’s really helpful to understand from a context standpoint is there’s not a lot of opportunity.
To connect the existing lines, which are these black dots, march stations to the Beltline. And so we’re gonna be talking about some really powerful stuff in Southwest that is going on with called the sack. And these large mobility plays zooming into the southeast area. There’s the stuff you may have seen the news.
There’s a State farmers market which was in public Rfp. Quasi governmental agency owns it, trying to sell it allegedly. There’s still tons of ongoing negotiation. So there’s only a little bit of this I can talk about, which is kind of the cool, big media project.
Everybody was interested in following, but the other project we’ve helped with that’s moving a little bit faster. We call a 1314. Murphy. This is a really critical anchor for the city of Atlanta. In that. There’s a spur. The Beltline Abi, the the quasi Government agency owns most of this land.
They don’t own this little yellow piece which is in the land. The cul-de-sac, purchased. So part of this is looking at key connectivity of the Beltline down here. This is the Oakland City, Martin station. So this is how it lands.
Beltline will connect to transit and southwest there’s a few other options in the northeast, Central, but this is critical, for the southwest part of town. So when we talk about market mobility, we’re also looking at, you know. Beltline, and larger forms of mobility in Atlanta.
This is a really big part of that. There we go. Come on, there we go. And so when we talk about the State farmers market, this is the additional look. There will have to be some adaptive reuse this has to go through a community input process.
There’s definitely a goal to utilize some of the town or the I’m sorry that courtyard product you know, that was been refined and started in Tempe there’s definitely gonna be some 4 and 5 story mixed use buildings.
There will be some talent home there will most likely be a parking deck in this development, based on a range of trade offs to provide adequate parking to you.
The office incubator, retail spaces that are involved, and for site size this is about 20 acres of here and a lot of the final uses and mixes are in flux.
We haven’t really, been able to begin community engagement because we’re still not there yet with the Belt Line in terms of negotiations on the site. So it’s been a long, hard road to get here with a Beltline.
This is their second time taking this site to market, we run a team for the first time, went to market many years ago. That was a our team not get selected. It was a political disaster for Abi. So we’re hoping they can get this on call to sack.
So they can move that forward in a positive fashion. There we go. Come on next page. There we go, and then again, it’s more of the more renderings of activation on the ground. There is a very significant and appropriate emphasis on small business incubation definitely for minority business centers.
So we’re looking at high level strategies, smaller spaces. How do you support and activate? You know this gets into attendance, improvement, strategies and rent some subsidies. But a lot of this in terms of making a place appropriate to Southwest Atlanta is about inclusion.
So equity, it’s back. How do we integrate these things to make it viable for everybody? So there and then, quick, briefly, to show how this stuff starts to connect. This is the Beltline is up over here. This orange is owned by the Beltline.
This darker gray is the land that called us sac would contribute to help make this connection happen we’re working diligently with the city of Atlanta. The Beltline and other groups to look for fast track funding to get this trail lay in as soon as possible, coincidentally bought a site across the street.
So we’ve got this 5 acre site here, and then the site across the street, and just to give you a sense, you know, Dan’s metrics are great. We’re called. The stack started at 40 units per acre, and Tempe land prices.
Construction costs and other pressures have got us at 120 units an acre here, so we’re triple. The density to make this project work there, and so, in terms of a quick site diagram breaking into phases.
There will be some 5 over actually, 5, over 2, 5 over, one to 5, over 2, due to basement and grading considerations for topography here in this primary building, some tightening, and focusing on the courtyard product.
Still he to keep this as a core component, called the sack, but this is another 5 of our one building.
In order to make this project feasible. This is all the public that lines fine, working through a couple of different phases of how it’s get gets activated, maintain space for future transit and near term, and long term pedestrian connectivity as well, come on Mouse.
There we go so quick diagram, and looking at a lot of the bike and pedestrian connectivity there will be connection to the train station but we do see a lot of the coming and going coming from the bypass here through the beltline spur and then also you know, as dan’s
Had this really great fireline diagrams. Ours were a bit simpler in terms of how this works, you know, seeing the center as a pose and being really thoughtful about how we do that with limited, you know, short term parking for business, but you know, most of the the parking back here only for
Retail out of the way to Back Alley. Really kind of focusing in the core of this is pedestrian experience. A little bit quick diagram of retail and activation.
The other thing. That’s a core public space component is, we have a a bit of bizarre right of way due to realignment of roads for crossing into the train tracks years ago. So we have a large public plaza that’s been a large center piece of community conversation about how does this get activated?
How do we make this amazing? And how do we do that in the public right away? So, working with the city agencies to make that go as well again.
We do have some parking, you know, in pink, for the commercial, looking at being thoughtful, trying to minimize how the cars come in and are relegated to limited components of the site from a flow standpoint.
Lots of bike parking distributed one of the other things that are, you know, Key, I think in both projects is there’s a tremendous amount of interior safe, secure bike parking a tremendous focus on Eb charging as well for the interconnection.
But this is just a diagram I really call it guest parking, you know. So I think we ended up with yeah 144 guest parking spaces for bikes. And we are targeting around one bike space per unit for interior parking. In addition to that, again. Couple of quick, you know, inspiration images.
And kind of typical right for that center space, you know, we’ll make good paving good street engagement, you know, for where that is headed there. Come on, mouse, and then some early rendering.
So the Plaza activation again, you know, call sex, and a great job in Tempe of that tactical activation to get people engaged. And the goal is for this plaza to be that long term site for activation.
As part of this. This project’s development also, knowing that this is gonna work as a bit of a in a connection to the larger Murphy crossing site which is the State farmers market, the main 20 acre site come on some early concepts of renderings, you know.
Just really looking at, making sure there’s good massing. There’s good engagement for the retails, and invite the plaza. Looking at connection for the multifamily again, keeping it simple, keeping us stay, trying to focus on better materials.
But you know, helping them get an initial concept to work through initial approvals to get into a site permitting. And one of the things you know. Again, some tighter passageways, you know, try to be cognitive scale of how these buildings are going to integrate as a early stage design component.
This is some 3 stor courtyard product, but we’ll show you in the next slide that in order to get some of these densities, the 3 story product for courtyard now it’d have to be tightened.
But we ended up with some partial 4 story components here, one to get the unit yield, but also to make sure we get adequate light and air coming into these courtyards.
But this is 2 stories of flats, and then up to the third floor, you’ve got 2 store units above to get a little bit extra density. And happy to turn over Lauren for.
Yes, absolutely. Thank you so much for your wonderful presentations. See things visualized, and especially these 2 projects being a different stages, kind of what’s to come, especially. And speaking of these being 2 different projects, this is basically a template that is being implemented in 2 different car centric cities.
How do these projects differ in design? And how do the different land bases and yields impact the projects? As a result? So I might start the LAN. Obviously, you know, some of my presentation touched on, you know, a lot more density, you know.
We’ve had a lot of conversations that I with called the sac guys things still need to be fleshed out in terms of what’s called placemaking within these larger format buildings, you know, not just on the ground, but in the interior spaces.
So there’s a an even greater role for the architecture to work through. Some of those things, so that exists. But I do think also, I think you know, Tempe, you know it’s hot, but they’ve got some.
It’s flat. They’ve got some great connectivity in the white rail coming in Atlanta, I think, also gets a misnomer as being very car centric, and a lot of the city is.
But most of the core. City, and built before the nineteenth in the 19 twenties, or up to 19 twenties, has some amazing walkability, and what it tends to suffer from is connectivity between these different neighborhoods is not as great as we’d like but evikes are an amazing equalizer right and
That’s been really transformative in Atlanta without call the sack to see how much Ebtes are really giving people mobility options, and how massively the Beltline’s getting utilized.
So you know, cul de sacs. Comments were that they were pluging into a rapidly avoiding system in Atlanta as opposed to trying to convince a car centric city to do something else. And, Dan, you’re on mute this time. I think that the climate response is like one major difference, like we.
We wouldn’t plant a project that looks like codes. Act Tempian. Too many other places in the United States, whether it’s Atlanta or anywhere else, because the urbanism and the architecture is very responsive to that and the precedents we studied were responsive to that.
I think super interesting is to see as their idea evolves, and land values increase and construct costs.
Increase, of how, how they can sort of hold on to their core concept and values and mission, and but how can create designers like Eric and his team like sort of take the design to the next level of how can you do 4 stories instead of 2 and 3 but still achieve what they’re trying
To achieve. With the courtyard spaces and the public realm. So. But it’s I think that’s pretty common. And even even in non carfree projects, is right. If you’re in terms of the in terms of the place, making.
But you know it’s I saw a bunch of questions in in the about sort of how did you convince people that this was viable?
And I think what’s really interesting is when the project called Set Tempe first went public in the I think, was the Wall Street Journal in October, or certain November of Gosh. What was it? 2020? I remember all these comments of like, Oh, nobody’s ever gonna live car free!
And Tempe, this project’s gonna fail miserably, and I just did some really quick math of like what the entire Phoenix Metro sort of rental market was, and I think they need to capture like point 0 0 0 2% of the entire market to be successful and and like
I think one thing that new urbanism has proven from the very beginning is that there’s a market for for different living choices that are that are more urban, more walkable, and a think this is just like taking that to the next level of like yes, there are people that want to live
Car free does, does not 90% of the Us. Population want to live car free? Probably not. But does 5, 6, 7, or 1020% meet. If you give them a choice that are that choice that’s outside of the major metropolitan centres at a neighborhood scale. So.
I would add, you know what things I saw with 10 p. Is you’ve got like, said then Asu is what 70,000 students is.
One of the largest public universities in the nation, and it’s only a couple of metro stops away so as a complete fall back, you know, you got kids in college, maybe not having cars, a few stops away to live in a pretty amazing spot.
Like, not that you want this to be a student housing, but like I’m sure the developer investor side we’re like, you know, that’s a really easy, safe target market. If you don’t match your other folks.
Yeah, and the other interesting thing that’s happened is, I think, over half of the first phase residents are moving from out of state into this project. So it’s become a real destination. And so what market exists is almost not even.
It doesn’t matter like the market’s gonna the market is coming and it’s sort of people.
Then. And the other interesting thing is, you know, I think, that we had a lot of discussions about like what type of households we’ll live in this type of community, and you know this has happened in most of our missing middle scale projects as the baby boomer show up in far
Bigger numbers than anybody expects, and the single person households and actually, families have shown, you know, shown started to show up in ways that I don’t think any of us necessarily expected. But I think it’s fantastic.
Wonderful, yeah, really interesting to kind of hear about all the different groups that are interested in these and how they might not necessarily be the stereotypical ones that you would think of for these kinds of projects, and that also doug tails nicely with the next question, I wanted to pick your brains on which
Is, what kinds of public and private partnerships do these projects work? What and like. What is the role of political will in getting these projects started and gaining momentum. I mean I we’ve I think, you know cul de sac had, so I’ll let Dan talk to Tempe.
But in Atlanta one of the critical things is Tim Keen, our former planning Commissioner helped get a range of zoning reforms.
Quick fixes passed from like 2017 to 2019, one of which was that there was no parking required with it for any uses within half mile of transit, and so that just takes the parking conversation off the table right? You don’t have to provide it. You can just focus on what you wanted.
You know what you want to provide in working with the communities to get approval for the 1314 project. We’re right next to the train and the rail with railroad and the Marta line.
And so there’s limited crossings. There’s a lot of neighbor concern about traffic and backing up all the typical things we expect from a community, and they knew about cul de sac, and we didn’t even actually tell them it was called the sack going through the community process for the first
Project that was kept completely under wrath. But the community was just really appreciative that we’re doing a Low Park project that would add amenity that would continue to traffic that would help get rooftops for other retail to come. So that in itself was really helpful. We really even call the sack.
We’ve been pushing on the city for offsite improvements. That’s for trail. I showed huge right? There’s definitely other infrastructure that’s necessary. That just the private development side can’t pay for all that.
So having the city come in with this infrastructure is a huge deal, and that’s a pretty, a pretty reasonable ask, I think, for the city also, when all the constituents are alignment. Asking for it, too. Right? It’s not the developer versus the neighborhood we’re all on the same team.
How do we get some investment in Southwest Atlanta? Sorry, Lauren. I was multitasking. Not so successfully was a question about entitlement. We can add that to it, for sure it was mainly just about the role of political will and public private partnerships. Okay, I mean, that’s really important. I mean in in Tempe.
Very early on a number of city Council members in the mayor became big champions of the project and I would say in most of our projects, that’s the case.
And you know, from a even just from an economic development perspective who doesn’t want to be the city on the cover of the Wall Street Journal like, it’s really good press for your city.
So, I think the decision makers realize that pretty early on and the innovation that was being brought to the table. And you know, the site was really interesting. I mentioned it was pre entitled for a much bigger project. And so it actually made the entitlement a lot easier.
Actually the city wanted bigger buildings. It’s very rare that the developer’s saying, No, we only want 2 and 3 in the city saying, No, we want 5 to 7 but there was there was negotiation, and the parking was you know, there were early conversations about hey?
A corner of the site, you know of. That’s now a future face could be a parking lot if this completely fails, you know, and nobody shows up. But I I think the culk team knew there was viability in this, but they were. They’re willing to sort of work with the city on that.
And then it was an amendment to what’s called a pad in Tempe Plan Area development, just like a Pd or similar pop process. But and but there was part of the entitlement process. We took about 12 months, which is pretty quick, I think, for Tempe was.
It was an extensive design package that was required to be submitted I mean, we elevated every single building, not a small amount of work, and not a small expense for the developer, but we worked very closely in the cul-de-sac team continues to work very closely with the
Tempe staff. On sort of getting this implemented. One of the things I’ll add to that, you know, in terms of the role of public private partnerships is that you know, cul Thisack, when they’re coming out of the gate. We’re both targeting Atlanta and Tempe and Tempe move faster.
And so they started in Tempe. Right? So by moving faster, that’s engagement with political leadership a little bit easier site from entitlement standpoint. But again, if you want, call the sack to come to your town, it helps to get the parking apartments out of the way.
Haven’t engaged leadership ready to help help make these things happen. Yeah, because I mean, it’s inherent in the points. And all of what we presented is the projects break a almost every development regulation in the city.
So it’s not like what it’s not just the parking I mean, it’s there’s a lot of asks to make these projects possible. And it takes it takes the partnership of the city, even if it’s not a formal partnership. Just a just to help get these projects through that process.
And you know, the Tempe site was really interesting. I wasn’t very sure about it at first, but it actually doesn’t have very many adjacent neighbors to sort of push back on a project so I think that was one of the reasons it was able to work its way through pretty quickly.
It was a the patchy corridor that it’s along is pretty sort of dissiminated corridor, like you see in a lot of cities, and a lot of sort of really low value single story buildings.
A lot of it was vacant hotel buildings, motel, sorry motel buildings, and was a place that just needed a needed some investment. Very cool. Let me see. I’ll ask one more of my questions.
Then we’ll open it up to the so my last question for you both is, How does car free urbanism impact the community? And what are the mobility conditions of each project, and how do they integrate with existing transit? And bike systems which you’ve touched on a little bit.
But Justin to do it again. Yeah, I’ll let Dan take this one first.
Alright, I’m gonna say that impacts are something that’s been made up by planners that I just really don’t like if we had to study the impacts of urbanism every time that something was built we wouldn’t have the great urban places that we have today, I think we need to flip that narrative.
And how do these sorts of things benefit the community? And how are they? Good for the environment. You know. If you remove 600 cars from a project like 600 fewer cars on the neighborhood streets, that’s a really great thing. It’s also great for the environment.
So I think it’s I think that it’s really interesting that we sort of almost always in these conversations sort of flip toward impact. And the reality is, we need to sort of think about what the benefits are, instead of thinking about impacts. I mean, you wouldn’t need to be thoughtful about, you know.
Ultimately, their meeting to be parking management in place around the cul de sac site. There currently isn’t. But you don’t want to let that sort of hold up a project or not make a project possible. I mean I think I’m gonna picking you back.
What Dan saying, and that you know, and particularly, I think, for both locations, but particularly for Southwest Atlanta communities for years, have been clamoring for you know we want retail. We want stores. We want the benefits of living in a city that don’t exist here.
Right now, and it’s like, Well, you need rooftops right.
Into a call to sex able to do is bring a lot of rooftops, but also be really intentional and thoughtful with the retail they’re bringing, because, you know, they talk about this hyper local retail where residents are going to spend a lot more of their dollars at the retail
On site, because it’s right. Their intermediate. And it’s, you know, there’s more resistance to going further off site than being present, I think that’s and then the other thing is, you know, we have only about 20,000 square feet of retail in total at the the pilot
I call the pilot at 1314, but the main farmers, markets site at 20 acres of a lot more. And so you’re really bringing a lot of amenity. A lot of Co working incubator space to the community. So I think you know it’s just it’s positive impact, right?
It’s bringing jobs, opportunity, beer, tacos, items to communities that want all of the above. Wonderful and yes, here at Cnu we are very interested in discussions about car, free urbanism, so I’m gonna open this up.
Q&A. And I have combined a couple of questions from the audience that are about affordable housing within the development. Basically, these questions are, what is the ratio? And then also our costs offset at all by the fact that there is not parking on site. I’ll jump because we I think we have.
I know we have more for itability in our projects than Tempe. You know, Atlanta, we have inclusionary zoning in our Beltline corridor, and we were in it for the 1314 site. We just for math. You have to do either 15% of your units at 80% of ami.
That’s that turns into translates like 1,500 bucks for a one bed, I think, like 1,700 bucks for a 2 bed, and that’s 2022 numbers. You could also do. 10% is 60% of ami. But the 15% at 80. Sorry if they’re in the math round.
That’s the math that people tend to do. But what we’ve been doing with call To sac and other development frauds is pushing our developer clients to say you’re not going to get through zoning with just the minimums you’re gonna have to offer more and the more that
We’ve typically been pushing clients to offer is at least do an extra fees at the 60% of Ami. That’s a big deal, but when you’re providing extra you can modify the requirements to say those could only be studios right?
That would be enough to meet it. Cul de sac wanted to go studio heavy for some of the 6 and the 5 and 6 story buildings anyways, and when you’re going car white, you can make the math work right right now.
It’s a 1,000 bucks a month for a studio, and if you’re at about 340 square feet, like we’re called to sac we’re at 3 bucks a foot right from a rental standpoint.
So that’s not crazy, you know, but you. So we’re also having clients unbundled parking and not fully park out the studios and other deals as well to achieve the affordability, which is a political necessity in Atlanta.
You’re not gonna get it. You’re not gonna get your voting. You’re sending approvals unless you’re bringing something to the table in that realm. And there’s currently a range of negotiations on affordability levels both for commercial and residential.
Still happening with Lynn Beltline that as we’re negotiating, try to get that project moving forward, and then there’ll be another round of negotiations with the community after that, for sure. Yeah, I think in the in Tempe if they’re all market rate.
And I think part of this is, you’d imagine the level of risk that a developer is taking for A to develop a the country’s first car-free project, and so really needing to prove the concept prove the viability and that in future projects be thinking about
You know, percentage affordability before thinking about green building. Be thinking about all these other things that are ideal, and all of us would love to include in the projects.
But just proof of concept was really important. Right as a first, and like there was so much risk inherent in, and even just the car-free aspect that that’s at least wanted to focus on. Let’s get let’s get one built let’s see how the market
Responds, and then we can do all these other things. We wanna be doing on the future projects? Once we prove the concept. Thanks so much, Dan, that also answers a couple of questions in the that are interested in the role of nature.
And climate adaptation for these projects. Oh, is there anything else that we wanna add there? Otherwise. I mean. I think you know Dan’s responses to the desert climate are really great, you know. Atlanta’s, much more about having active, you know.
Also having active outdoor spaces, you know, but we’re hotter and wetter, so you know good porch is good cover, but good, you know, kind of semi-private space as a buffer and filter, particularly the ground level where some of the things we looked at as we’re
Working through our layouts and designs. But I think again adapt to climate. No where. I give people good outdoor spaces that are, you know, usable and wonderful. Yeah, we had a really talented landscape architect on our team sort of give a shout out to her.
Chris Floors her name, Flora and associates, and obviously the selection of the the plantings was very thoughtful in terms of the desert. The climate as well, but the other interesting thing is outside of the core, mixed use area, which is just that corner by the transit station.
The entire project is decomposed, granted. So it’s sort of you’re not sort of constantly on a paved surface that will also be reflecting heat.
And then the the design of the the design of the courtyards, the smaller secondary public spaces, and how the landscape integrates into those very thoughtfully is a really was a really, it’s sort of a just a level of thoughtfulness and desert responsiveness
That was in here is inherent in the design that won’t really be like that’s coming.
The trees. The trees were starting to be planted a couple weeks ago. I almost showed a video of a little bobcat tractor with a tree in the in the shovel, trying to get through the little like to get to the spot where the tree needed to be planted and but it’s.
There. They’re cursing you the whole time. Right. Damn it, Dan! Yeah. He’s screaming. Did you plan this project? But yeah, it’s we were thoughtful, it’s and then there is one park space right in the middle, like a larger.
I’ll say green. It won’t be like a lawn, but it’ll be more heavily landscaped and sp, for the dog park will be, and a little bit more heavily landscaped and really thoughtful location and types of plantings to make it very livable.
Yes, it’s very interesting that these 2 projects are in such different climates that are approaching some of the same issues and creative ways. The next kind of group of questions that we have from the. Connection. This is both connection to the downtown and connection within the cul-de-sac region itself.
So basically, the 2 questions are, how connected to major employment centers are each of these projects in a car feature way, and how connected are they for people with limited mobility to move around the cul de sac site? Then you wanna go first.
Yeah, it’s I mean, first of all, well, 2 transit stops to the west is downtown. Tempe, which has the university in a major employment center. What’s happening to Trans are probably 3 or 4 transit stops to the east downtown mesa.
We did a form base code there about 7 years ago, and it’s now exploding has about 500 million dollars a private sector investment in it. So that’s another major sort of employment center that’s starting to happen.
But I think there’s also this notion that a lot of people are going to be working remotely. There’s a co-working, a large Co working space in in the sort of community center mixed use center as well.
And there are what we call bookable spaces in each of the courtyards has several bookable spaces, where, if you want to have a meeting with somebody, or do a live, you know, social media stream, you can book one of these spaces for a day, you know to work with that so there’s a lot of different ways
That the design has sort of thought about different types of employment sort of conditions. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I think you know, Co, working is coming into, you know, both the small project get 1314 for us. And then definitely a range of Co working at the larger project connection.
Wise access to jobs. You know, we do have a Marta H.
Rail station, you know a half a walk away from the 1314 site, but in addition to that, you know, the Beltline or Beltline is getting built out, and probably in the next 18 months we will have the whole Eastern half of the Beltline Paved and finished at that Point with an Evike your
۳۰ min to Pawn City market, and I say that because that is the epicenter of tech jobs. Now, that’s not maybe not like the most equitable broad based job centre. But that is a powerhouse of tech on the east side of town, and a 30 min bike ride.
You will get there significantly, faster and rush hour, traffic than in a car.
And so the bell line is transport, and evokes are absolutely transformative where you can go, how you can go and how fast it’s going to take in Atlanta, and it will be greatly significant than having to be stuck in a vehicle, so you know the mart of the train will get you
Downtown. There’s bus access as well, but we I was joking with Duke, who’s one of the you know.
Great folks call tech working on this. He’s living over on the East Side of town, close to where I am, and he’s having to go down to the site, and I asked him, Do you take martyred? Do you Bike? He’s like it’s faster to eat bike right now.
It’s a 30 min bike from like northeast central Atlanta down to southwest Atlanta, on gravel trails than it is to take a car right or to take the trail right. So like. That’s what we’re looking at as we think. City mobility.
Very cool. And then this is one kind of to hopefully encapsulate a number of the questions that are left in our, which is, what guidance do you have for others who are looking to create car-free developments, especially now that this kind of has proof of concept. Dan, you wanna start.
Yeah, I mean, I I think, what’s great about this is it’s I mean, the first phase residence need to are gonna move in here shortly. But I think once the first couple of phases are occupied and stabilized, I think that it proved it, you know, proves the concept.
I know there’s like last time I knew it was like 4 or 5,000 people on an interested list of you know, so I don’t think there’s going to be a shortage of demand, but I think that I think what’s great about cul de sac is they’re really committed to
Their. You know this idea of this idea of the car freaky community, and they’re adapting it obviously, as they go. And we’ll need to continue to adapt it. But I mentioned it earlier.
There are a couple of the smartest people I’m Jeff and Ryan are couple of the smartest people I know, and their team sort of are all super super smart people, too.
So I think that just kind of sticking, sticking to that vision, and sort of not just being willing to sort of find ways to push for and build support for the concept and to not compromise the point where so it’s it’s compromising that vision, because I think you know
Similar to way that new urbanism was responding to the demand for walkable living.
I think this is responding to the man. Now, for car-free living, and one of the things we talked about a little bit in the preparation sort of discussion was like, should more new reports be promoting car-free urbanism, because you know, I think
Maybe this, this is the future, you know. It’s I think there’s a clear demand for it. And I think I think you could do this in a lot of different markets, and it would be very viable.
I think one of the interesting conversations I had with Ryan and Jeff were were related to scale, and I think it’s context of place, and I think what’s helpful is both we look at Tempe in Atlanta.
Both of these contexts were amenity white, right in terms of what did the neighborhoods have in existing conditions for people to benefit from so they, I think they, Riley, have a minimum viable scheme to come in and to create the they’re there to have enough support
Amenity to support a car wide or car-free lifestyle, and you know the conversation we had is that, like, you know, just a 200 unit multi-family deal, you’re not creating enough there of support for this kind of transition. I self developed a little 16 unit college community without any parking.
And we are comparing the notes. It’s like, you know, we get 1220 us you can fit into an existing neighborhood, and people can park on street or choose not to have cars like you can work with the existing systems in that scale and if you’re at like 15 to 20 acres you can create
Your own ecosystem like if you don’t have a vibrant community with all these amenities pre existing, it’s hard to do a mid-size project that’s gonna be viable. So if you wanted to mid-size. You need to be very amenity. Rich. And so in Atlanta. That’s like Midtown Atlanta.
So it’s more challenge to developers in midtown, Atlanta, where you have the amenity you have all the stuff at your doorstep. You need to be thinking there, particularly about car lights, right? So again, context is really important to figure out where and how to try these things along with scale.
Yeah, that’s a really interesting point. Because Eric, I think you worked on this is Summer fill in Atlanta that I saw when I was out there. It is. Yeah. That sort of one of the early focuses was that main street, and making the mainstream a destination and attractive amenity. Yeah.
And I know a developer in Omaha, Nebraska. Basically, he had bought up a bunch of apartments around like missing middle aggregated apartments. But then he bought up most of the Main street buildings, and just invested in that, because he knew it would.
Create the type of place at the his residence would wanna live in. Yeah. And that one just says a quick comment was, it was a really easy conversation. The developers were parting with Georgia, State.
This was the first phase of a many phase massive, probably 1 billion dollar investment over their by the former brave stadium. After the Braceleft town, and they knew they needed to get it right. They need to get that downtown Vibe get the place happening to set the tan for all future development.
But the other thing that was great is that we had all these vacant parking lots behind our main street, so we never talked about parking right. There’s like transitional parking. It’s funny to get the vibe right to get it going.
And we actively plan to get rid of a lot of those parking lots. And you know Hedgewood, a local, great nearest developer, came a little Oliver design, some amazing stuff to chew up the parking incrementally, and the place.
It’s amazing. You know, the main street that we help with is kicking ass, taking names. But all the housing blue and Hzard did is amazing.
They’ve got other stuff coming in. But again, if we had to worried about parking, and we had some, not a ton of parking for the retail, we would have never got off the ground, and it was a helpful strategy from incrementing kind of slowly waiting the everybody off the parking as a place
Continue to build out. So there’s enough support when it was just getting started for the businesses. But they’re getting less and less parking now, and more and more people coming. Wonderful thanks. So much for your insights, and it looks like with that.
We are just a little past 10’clock, so we can go ahead and wrap this up. A recording of this webinar will be available on our website within 24 h. So thank you very much, Dan and Eric, for taking the time to talk with us today. So thank you for having us.
Thanks, Lauren, thanks for having me.
Date: 2023-04-11 23:07:16
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